comp.sys.mac.advocacy

On Sat, 05 Apr 2008 13:07:21 -1000, David Fritzinger
wrote:

>In article
><3acdc0e7-cdd0-4aaa-8e10-613703533044@m71g2000hse.googlegroups.com>,
> "Mayor Of R'lyeh" wrote:
>
>> On Apr 5, 7:01 am, -hh wrote:
>> > Megadave wrote:
>> > > Christianity had nothing to do with that. It was little
>> > > more than an extreme turf war and people just being assholes.
>> >
>> > Ah, so that explains the Crusades,
>>
>> The Crusades were a war of reconquest. They were no more immoral than
>> the Reconquista of Spain or the Muslim conquest of Christian lands in
>> the first place.
>
>Except, of course, for all the excesses that were done in the Church's
>name during the crusades.

They were done in the name of war, not the Church. While we may think
of them as excessive and crue, for those times it was just another
Tuesday.

>>
>> > the Spanish Inquisition,
>>
>> Established by the Spanish Crown, not the church. All executions were
>> committed by secular authorities.
>
>Actually, you are wrong. There were 3 inquisitions, and they were
>supported by the Catholic Church.

The Church wasn't stupid. They learned from the Knights Templar.
Your source confirms what I wrote.
"The secular authorities were to carry out the execution."
" At the end of the 15th century, under Ferdinand and Isabel, the
Spanish inquisition became independent of Rome."


>http://galileo.rice.edu/chr/inquisition.html

What they leave out is the fact that Galileo's troubles were mostly of
a personal nature. The same Cardinal that had been sheltering Galileo
and allowing him to continue his work only turned on Galileo after the
Cardinal had become Pope and Galileo wrote a book that put the words
of the very same man who had protected Galileo all those years into
the mouth of a fool. You'd be pretty pissed too. You might even use
whatever authority you had to make life difficult for the little
backstabbing prick as well.
>>
>> the Holocaust,
>>
>> Comitted by atheists.
>
>Whether Hitler himself was an athiest is questionable

Not really.

>, but many, many Christians were Nazis, and participated in the Holocaust.

Once you start participating in mass murder you've demobnstrably
dropped even any pretense of fealty to Christian principles. You can
call yourself anything you want but your deeds demonstrate what you
really are.

> And, let's
>face it, the Holocaust was nothing more than the culmination of a long
>tradition of antisemitism in Christian Europe. This tradition stretches
>back to Martin Luther, at least.
>http://www.humanitas-international.org/showcase/chronography/documents/lu
>ther-jews.htm

Actually it goes back as far as Judaism itself.
I could never understand why Jews were so hated until I saw a PBS show
called 'Postville'. It documents a group of New York Jews who move to
a small town in Iowa to start a kosher slaughterhouse.
They moved from New York City to a place that has the most kindhearted
and welcoming people on the face of the earth and proceeding to do
just about everything they could to royally piss them off. If that's
how Jewish communities have been throughout time I can see how it
would lead to bad blood betwen them and their neighbors.
Of course being a PBS show the whole tone of it was 'Look at those
white Christian racists in Iowa. You can tell they're racists because
they don't have an intimate understanding of New York City Jews.'
And for good measure they toss in at the end 'There's Mexicans here as
well and the local Catholic Church still insists on conducting
services in English instead of Spanish just because 90% of its
congregation are English speakers. How racist!'.
It seems toi have dropped the main PBS site but its still on the Iowa
PBS site.
http://www.iptv.org/postville/

>
>Nearly every country in Europe expelled their Jews at one time or
>another, and pogroms were widespread in Eastern Europe. No, Mayor, the
>antisemitism that eventually led to the Hitler and the Holocaust long
>existed in Europe.
>[snip]
--

Why settle for the lesser evil?
Cthulhu for president 2008.